View Full Version : any one know anything about Holley Economaster carbs?
01-04-2009, 11:49 AM
I just returned from a swap meet; got 2 carbs (carb guys were there in abundance today); at least 4 booths were at least 1/2 full each, of "rebuilt" overpriced carbs-what do they consider "rebuilt"; and by who? Some actually looked NICE and well done-- others-ugh!!
A few "only run 100 miles; yeah right; then why did they get pulled? You can only believe "so many" of those stories, you know!
Then, there were the share of used cores/parts carbs scattered as usual.
I picked up a couple of these; more out of curiosity than anything. I got them cheap enuf that if they wind up as door stops it won't hurt me.
Typically in the past I have associated Holley 4 barrels with "gas hog", but these 2 have me wondering. I remember hearing about these in years past, but never had my hands on one.
I believe these are both Economasters. The numbers on them are L 7454 and L 7556. Anyone have any info on them? Outwardly they most resemble a Q jet over any other carb I've seen before. Both are manual choke. 1 has a vac pull off diaphragm the other looks like it did at one time (or should have anyway) and is also missing the inlet nut (again think Q jet) What parts are available? What CFMs? Easy adaptation to Mopar style linkage? Elec choke kit available, or adaptable to these? I dunno how well I could trust my wife with a manual choke.
They are not that crusty, though the one missing the bowl nut has a bit of rust where the bowl nut should screw in. they definitely appear rebuildable. Nothing froze up. Butterfliy sizes are slightly different between them; one has all 4 being almost the same size; the other has more difference in size between primary and secondary. Either worth experimenting with on a stock 318? (either my Fury, OR my truck; both are currently 2 barrel set ups) Would a regular parts store (Car Quest, Napa, etc) be able to get parts (kits, pull offs, etc) would standard Holley jets interchange (I was recently given a Holley jet assortment, not unlike a Carter Strip Kit) I don't want to pull them apart until I at least locate kits and floats first and get some opinions on them. Lotsa vacuum ports. Either considered an "emissions" carb/usable with a charcoal canister? Either more/less desirable than the other? Guessing I'd say they are ~450-500 CFM.
01-04-2009, 12:21 PM
I had one on my 68 Coronet for several years and the car ran well and gave decent mileage. I took it off last summer to put on the "REBUILT" thermoquad I bought through Summmit. I had a good run with it but it started to leak and the rubber pieces were basically gone! I still have it someplace around here and I thought they were called economisers?
01-04-2009, 01:08 PM
I've heard some folks speak well of them, but I had one on my '73 D100 and wasn't very fond of it. Between it and the SP2P intake, I picked up 1-2 mpg, but it wasn't suited to the needs of a truck.
01-04-2009, 01:50 PM
Thanks Gary; I don't use this thing as a truck that much though I've been driving it -alot. A friend of mine that I have not seen in years had the SP-2P and an Economaster-economiser (whatever they call them) on a 318 in a 78 D 200 crew cab/short bed and loved it! He used to drive that thing cross country at least a couple times a year-he was one of those that made his money hauling rust free sheet metal back to help us in the Rust Belt restore our cars. He always raved about the MPG and power vs the stock 2 barrel setup. I have had an SP 2P in a Diplomat and have no opinion of it beyond being so much lighter/easier to install compared to the cst iron spread bore factory intake it replaced. But I ran a 625 AFB on it. I WILL say that was the only vehicle that ever gave me fuel percolation troubles.
Anyone have any info on parts availability?
Hemibee; what engine does that car have in it (I remember your Thermojunk thread but I forget, now what engine that was on) I doubt it was a Hemi as your screen name suggests; as I doubt even 2 of these would feed a Hemi!
01-04-2009, 03:57 PM
My 68 coronet has a good old faithfull 318 runs like a top with the right carb. Will be attempting to do another thermo to put on there. Hindsite I would have tried to find the parts to redo the miser and put it back in service. I originally pulled it out of a pile of carbs and did not know what it was except that it was a spreadbore and would fit my manifold. I do not know the history of the carb but put it on and away I went. Had good luck with that one till it just wore out.
No this was not on a hemi, it has two AFB's on there.
01-05-2009, 07:45 AM
I used one on a customers Ramcharger that I converted from a 318 to a 360. We bought the intake (E-brock Performer) and Holley Economaster as an assembly out of the classifieds (before Ebay!),fresh off of a 360 B-van. It ran awesome, pulling the heavy Ramcharger 4X4 with ease and fair economy. It had headers and a stock 340HP cam, so it really would move out, I never wound it past probably 5,000rpm but it was fine. The guy that I did the work for still has the truck 15yrs later, and still loves it! He doesn't have to use 4-low range to pull his boat up the boat ramp now, like with the 318 2bbl!!! I recommend it if you need economy and torque, and aren't worried about top end performance. RB
01-05-2009, 08:38 AM
OK; of those that even have an opinion (I have asked on 2 other sites) everyone who has ever tried one loves them until they need any parts for them; which seem few and far between, saying that if it ever does need any repair it would be considered a "throw a way". Any input on that?
Also on that SP-2P, I have used one in the past; and other than the fact that it had a 4 barrel sized hole on top, and it was so much lighter and easier to "man handle" and install compared to the cast iron factory intake it replaced, I have no opinion on it compared to other 4 barrel small block Mopar intakes. but others seem love-hate, black or white about that one. they seem to be coming out of the woodwork at swaps and on Ebay in abundance, here lately. But, I will say that if I stumbled onto another, I would use it; either on my truck or my Fury.
01-12-2009, 10:24 AM
speaking of Holleys another subject has come up; I have been scouting Ebay for an integral elec choke to retrofit to one of these Economasters and the talk of 4150-4160-etc. is rearing its ugly head. The last 4 BBL Holleys were list 1850 I had. Is this a 4150? I have heard of these ECono carbs referred to, as a 4360. What do these mean: I know that these nubbers are different from "list" numbers; of which start with an "L" on both of these; (cannot find any parts info anywhere except Summit or Jegs) and all Economasters seem to be "lumped together; seems "one size fitz all" on parts for these particular carbs. all the other numbers I see relating to parts for a holley start with an "R".
01-12-2009, 12:47 PM
The 1850 is a manual choke, single feed 600 cfm 4160 carb.
Holley lists the numbers on the choke horn starting with R, you can then go to http://www.holley.com/data/TechService/Technical/Carb%20Numerical%20Listing.pdf and cross reference all the data about the carburetor and that will tell you which series it actually is.
01-12-2009, 01:15 PM
The 1850 is a manual choke, single feed 600 cfm 4160 carb.
Yeah I knew that but what does the "4160" mean? (I've had 2 of these; thats why I put that one up for example. it was a vac secondary model. Is that what "4160" means, with 4150s being dual feed or double pumper, or what???
Holley lists the numbers on the choke horn starting with R, you can then go to http://www.holley.com/data/TechService/Technical/Carb%20Numerical%20Listing.pdf (http://www.holley.com/data/TechService/Technical/Carb%20Numerical%20Listing.pdf) and cross reference all the data about the carburetor and that will tell you which series it actually is.
Thanks; but I cannot find a number that starts with an "r" on either of those 2 carbs; the only numbers I can find, say L7454 and L 7656. but I will go to that link and see if they pop up. OK; I found these numbers with an R instead of an L prefix; theu both come up as a 4360 series, 450 CFM, so I THINK that is the right info.
01-12-2009, 02:09 PM
you're probably finding the right info as I have been able to find every holley carb I've ever seen on that listing, including the one for a 1983 Ford Mustang GT 5.0.
01-12-2009, 02:14 PM
OK....drive yourself nuts trying to figure out Holley carbs.........the only good ones they ever made were the 2bbl carbs used on the 360/400 engines, and even they could be a nightmare, if you didn't know how to blow out the idle tubes when you lost 1/2 the engine at idle!:rolleyes:
Holleys suck! :p:D
01-12-2009, 03:41 PM
Yup, R body; I've had that experience too. I already have this 9635 AFB, destined for my truck, (would love to find someone with a "spare" throttle shaft from a Mopar version, 9626/9636; so i would not have to use the hokey "adapter" on mine). but as I've said I got these cheap, 2 carbs and an Accel Super coil new-in-box, for less than what he had marked on the coil alone,at the swap meet. so I am thinking of doing some experimentation before they wind up File 13. Yeah I have to agree with you,though, my experience with most Holleys is the same as yours, pure junk.
On the 2210/2245 series 2 barrels you talk about, about I've had some REAL good ones and some REAL crappy ones. the one we had on Dad's 76 Charger with a 318-- became MY 1st car-- (yeah, we put the 2 BBL 360 intake on that motor) that ran very well. my cousin alao got lucky to get a good one on his 77 Fury. but I've had some doozies there; don't know if they were hodgepodge remans in a former life before I got them, or what; I was a whole oh, 13, when we got that car and 14 or 15, when we pulled the 360 out and put the 318 in.
01-12-2009, 07:37 PM
OK R body; my Ebay sourced AFB showed up today so I can revert the Holley experiment to another day. looks good though by the plastic tap storage boxes (yeah taps for cuttin threads) with various needles and seats in them and all the scribble notes on the card that came with the "strip kit" (one was incl with the Ebay carb) I think my 1st order of bus. is to put that one back to stock as it came out of the box. This carb is VERY clean and supposedly not run much. (aren't they all?)
01-15-2009, 06:50 PM
OK, 2 more developments; (OK, 3;) with it being below 0*F all day (hit a high of +12* yeaterday; wow today's HIGH was -9*) and headed to -25* tonite (windchill's supposed to be -45/-50*F) time in my as-yet-unheated garage, is severely limited; so I have (too much?) time to spend here with you guys; spent yesterday outside, between 2 of my tractors, my Deere 214, with the plow blade, and my kid's old Roper, with the 3' snow blower on it, goin' around the neighborhood clearing driveways; oooh my shoulders, elbows and forearms STILL ache today! :rolleyes::( I miss the 8-1/2' Meyer blade I had, with my old truck on days like this!
Now that the 625 AFB that I "settled" for, on not being able to find my original choice; a 500 CFM AFB; one pops up, via a wanted ad posted on another site; not the 9504 I was after (emissions/elec choke/univ model) but something better; a 9511, different from the 9504 because it has the Mopar bellcrank already! I guess i "pickle" the 9635 to keep it fresh (it has been run on a car, very recently) 'til the Volare motor is done; though, a curiosity here; according to the S-A books' "Carter Carburetors" book of the early/mid 80s there is only 1 difference between the 500 and 625 versions; primary venturis are the same diameter, the secondary venturi diameters though are different; the "bore size" ("Butterfly size", I assume) is the same between these 2 sized carbs. So that said, as long as I mainly run on the primaries, and don't "open it up", that there would be no difference between running a 500 vs a 625 AFB??
Side note; Anyone have the more recent version of that book, mentions both Carter Carbs and Edelbrocks in the title, written by the same guy as did the original one; remember, black cover, big yellow lettering? (I somehow have 2 of that version)
On the Holley option (down the road) I have been scouting Ebay; (see, R body, I don't spend "ALL" of my computer time here):eek::D:p and in swapping E mails among the sellers having these Econo carbs advertised, I have found a rebuilder that has one with the mopar linkage bellcrank, rather than my having to adapt these 2 Generic Motors' ones I have and he wants to trade me even up, my 2, good rebuildable GM version ones for a good rebuildable mopar one. Or he'll take my (1) Eddy #1405 for his Mopar E master I'm trying to "negotiate" a 1-for-1 swap, his E master for mine. so i have a "parts carb" left here, just in case I wind up needing parts to rebuild the one he has. Maybe that carb can sway my impression of Holleys, to the good? (I doubt it)
I am thinking ahead here a bit too; to warmer weather, and being able to once again pull the Fury out of hibernation. I definitely wanna do a Lean burn-ectomy, right out of the gate this year, as well as a possible 4 barrel swap along with it. If I find another deal on a good-used alum intake between now and then or, at a mimimum a rebuildable Non Leanburn BBD or (gasp) Holley 2280. in which case I can do the de-Lean burn and retain the factory 2 barrel setup.
My wife and I have been talking (pipe dream at this point; she has to OK the time off as vacation from her job; but has a new ration of 3 weeks starting in 2 months) but seeing as I am not going back to work any time soon; and the power Tour is mostly in the Midwest this year, the possibility of taking the trip this year---- in the Fury! at least the 1st 1/2, though it would be nice to do the long Haul. a small 4 barrel seems just the ticket for such a trip! I have been asking about tent sites near by, or on the grounds where the daily destinations are. (he he he) though I have friends near So. Bend that I could stay with that nite)
01-15-2009, 08:49 PM
While I don't believe the Holley 2280 is great for gas mileage (never was for me, but I didn't attempt to adjust the powervalve or anything of that nature), I do have a nice non-lean burn one I can get rid of if you've got your heart set on one. Like $25+shipping if you were interested.
Just for pics:
01-15-2009, 09:23 PM
No, my heart is not "set" on that carb; though if you are after mileage I have to say that I have had good and bad BBDs as well. I've had about equal results out of those 2 carbs. The truck is 1st priority right now, I have plenty of time to worry about the car; hopefully I get a little something from thing from Uncle Sam here within a month or so. Actually I have one of those carbs on my truck (non LB, standard 4 pin EI, advance equipped distributor) but it has some kind of solenoid screwed in where the bowl vent goes, I "could" use that one. The car also currently has a 2280 on it only w/o the vac adv nipple. Like I said lets see what pops up here in the short term. I will keep that one in mind though, thanks for offering.
02-05-2009, 03:11 PM
UPDATE; I traded both E masters (I think the guy was actually only expecting 1 of them) for another AFB; (makes 4 now I have) 1st 625 though that has Mopar linkage though without that silly adapter to make a Shivvy-spec carb work; my 500 also is already set up Mopar. Lets see; 1 each for the Fury truck and Volare and 1 spare! (well 2 spares until I get the Volare going) with the cams, and remainder of engine setup, and goals for each; I'm thinking 625 for Volare (if I don't stay with my orig idea of EFI on that one) 500 on daily driven truck, 625 on Fury (though the 500 would probably be a better match, I only have 1, and the truck sees more seat time)
02-05-2009, 07:29 PM
I just plan to run the Q-jet in my garage. MoPar elec choke, EGR. Will have to see if I get an EGR intake or not. I'd love to have matched ports if possible and have found out how to now. It is kind of kick in the face to find out how easy it is to get a 318 intake though, 2 of the most common 340/360 intakes are!
02-05-2009, 09:11 PM
I'd block off all the EGR crap though for sure.
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